tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post114015720767583865..comments2024-01-25T13:46:11.967-06:00Comments on The Bronze Blog: Enemy Reinforcements Identified as Another Rant of the Same TypeRyan Michaelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14750814560493466382noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1150725322854434022006-06-19T08:55:00.000-05:002006-06-19T08:55:00.000-05:00Ah. I see. Well, I think it sucks. Let's go back t...<I>Ah. I see. Well, I think it sucks. Let's go back to the stone [age] where what you saw was what you got.</I><BR/><BR/>No thank you.<BR/><BR/><I>"evolution didn't foresee societies as massive as the ones we have today" Evolution didn't foresee ANYTHING. It's random chance, puny little organisms that, over billions of years, somehow, in an absolutely astonishing outcome, became us. A bloated, destructive, altruistic mass entity.</I><BR/><BR/>Aside from a slight exaggeration of the role of random chance, you've got that right.<BR/><BR/><I>Well, guess what. Evolution has taken us as far as it can.</I><BR/><BR/>It probably still has a few tricks left, but yeah, I don't see it taking us much farther.<BR/><BR/><I>Human beings are responsible for themselves now. We can't rely on random chance to make things turn out right.</I><BR/><BR/>That's why technology is a wonderful thing. We've moved (almost) beyond gene evolution into meme evolution.<BR/><BR/><I>What is your ideology?</I><BR/><BR/>I tend to dislike labels, but I supposed "secular humanism" is the best fit I can think of right away.<BR/><BR/><I>You'll ask, "why do we need an ideology?"</I><BR/><BR/>No, I won't.<BR/><BR/><I>We are reaching the point where we can design ourselves. Screw evolution. It's a moot point.</I><BR/><BR/>Yeah. I watched "Robosapiens" this weekend. It was cool.<BR/><BR/><I>According to you, what is 'right' is what benefits the race as a whole.</I><BR/><BR/>I never said that.<BR/><BR/><I>At this point, altruism will get you killed. The world is too cynical for it. So what is right?</I><BR/><BR/>Sorry, but altruism and reciprocation still works. Thanks to it, I'm able to hand over some sheets of paper and metal discs to get a meal, rather than fight and likely get killed for it.<BR/><BR/>What is right roughly is acheiving your goals through means that cause the least interference with other people's goals.Bronze Doghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10938257296504189967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1150557821958394452006-06-17T10:23:00.000-05:002006-06-17T10:23:00.000-05:00Correction. *stone AGECorrection. *stone AGEAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1150557749225198082006-06-17T10:22:00.000-05:002006-06-17T10:22:00.000-05:00Ah. I see. Well, I think it sucks. Let's go back t...Ah. I see. Well, I think it sucks. Let's go back to the stone where what you saw was what you got. "evolution didn't foresee societies as massive as the ones we have today" Evolution didn't foresee ANYTHING. It's random chance, puny little organisms that, over billions of years, somehow, in an absolutely astonishing outcome, became us. A bloated, destructive, altruistic mass entity. <BR/><BR/>Well, guess what. Evolution has taken us as far as it can. Human beings are responsible for themselves now. We can't rely on random chance to make things turn out right. What is your ideology? You'll ask, "why do we need an ideology?" We are reaching the point where we can design ourselves. Screw evolution. It's a moot point. According to you, what is 'right' is what benefits the race as a whole. At this point, altruism will get you killed. The world is too cynical for it. So what is right?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1150198302188629782006-06-13T06:31:00.000-05:002006-06-13T06:31:00.000-05:00There you have the imperfections of the strategy. ...There you have the imperfections of the strategy. Altruism isn't always rational, but it's effective enough that that particular negative doesn't outweigh all the benefits. Additionally, if you'll forgive the reification, evolution didn't foresee societies as massive as the ones we have today.<BR/><BR/>Also, thanks to the concept of reputation, a person can pretend to be altruistic and gain disproportionate benefits from that appearance. That's how some politicians work.Bronze Doghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10938257296504189967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1150197564552836792006-06-13T06:19:00.000-05:002006-06-13T06:19:00.000-05:00That is true, except that we get nothing back for ...That is true, except that we get nothing back for the money we pour into welfare and providing clean needles for addicts and so on and so forth. They are not scratching our backs. They are a sinkhole of taxpayers money. Everywhere you can find examples of scum who take advantage of the generosity of others. Those others have something to contribute to society. The scum don't. Giving them our hard-earned cash so they can waste it doesn't seem very beneficial to me.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1149857515753123382006-06-09T07:51:00.000-05:002006-06-09T07:51:00.000-05:00So I'm asking a serious question now. Why aren't y...<B>So I'm asking a serious question now. Why aren't you all out there searching for religion? You're content with the thought that you're going to die, and that'll be it? That's ok with you?</B><BR/><BR/>How sould searching for religion change the existence or non-existence of an afterlife? If you've got evidence for one, please show us. The only reason I'm not looking for one is that all the leads I've ever had have dried up.<BR/><BR/><B>'Nother question I had. Society defines moral behavior. Moral behavior is typically that self-gain at the expense of others is wrong. Why is that? Moral behavior only benefits the WEAK. Those who can't or won't fight for what they want. Why should we help them?</B><BR/><BR/>You don't pay very much attention to society, do you? Altruism with reciprocation is a very effective means of reaching selfish goals.<BR/><BR/>A world of "you scratch my back, and I'll scratch yours" features more scratched backs.Bronze Doghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10938257296504189967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1149817029505617572006-06-08T20:37:00.000-05:002006-06-08T20:37:00.000-05:00Evolution has no such hierarchy, except maybe "Liv...Evolution has no such hierarchy, except maybe "Living > Dead." <BR/><BR/>Exactly. I love that. Living, Dead. So I'm asking a serious question now. Why aren't you all out there searching for religion? You're content with the thought that you're going to die, and that'll be it? That's ok with you? 'Nother question I had. Society defines moral behavior. Moral behavior is typically that self-gain at the expense of others is wrong. Why is that? Moral behavior only benefits the WEAK. Those who can't or won't fight for what they want. Why should we help them?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1141012666444305552006-02-26T21:57:00.000-06:002006-02-26T21:57:00.000-06:00Annoyance that I think plays a big role in this wh...Annoyance that I think plays a big role in this whole nonsense: Religiously-originating hierarchy: God > Angels > Men > Women > Some animals > Other animals.<BR/><BR/>Evolution has no such hierarchy, except maybe "Living > Dead."Bronze Doghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10938257296504189967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1140833779587484362006-02-24T20:16:00.000-06:002006-02-24T20:16:00.000-06:00Evolution caused slavery??? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha--...Evolution caused slavery??? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha-----unreal. Truly unreal. Who were the biggest slave owners? Religious people who won wars, I think. No- us thinking that we have the right to walk in on anyone whomp em around a bit because something is different-insert whatever here- and then have them be in servitude to us, is what causes slavery. <BR/><BR/>Maybe war really is peace too?? <BR/><BR/>Wow- people who don't believe in evolution have obviously never read their bibles, as it is full of references to slavery after war. Even the Israelites were slaves. It was because the dominating ideology of the day won with bigger weapons and more people, usually.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1140564246879499932006-02-21T17:24:00.000-06:002006-02-21T17:24:00.000-06:00Thanks, Dan. I thought my joke with a point was go...Thanks, Dan. I thought my joke with a point was good, too.<BR/><BR/>And yeah, those stages of moral development seem to cover it well. I try to do what will benefit society, but if I can think of an additional self-interest excuse, all the better.Bronze Doghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10938257296504189967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1140561277541625712006-02-21T16:34:00.000-06:002006-02-21T16:34:00.000-06:00" f I thought people should be "treated like anima..." f I thought people should be "treated like animals," would that mean I should go around trying to give people tummy rubs and kibble ('n bits 'n bits 'n bits)? Does it mean I should grab them with a Puffs-brand tissue and drop them in the garbage or out the door? "<BR/><BR/>That's <I>beautiful</I>! Simply beautiful.<BR/><BR/>Re - doing the right thing because a) reward/punishment, vs. b) want to be well regarded and c) it's for the good of society - great demonstration of <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kohlberg%27s_stages_of_moral_development" REL="nofollow">Kohlberg's stages of moral development</A>. Amusingly, "I must be good or I'll get in trouble" is considered the very first stage of moral reasoning - how little kids (and very limited adults) think . . .<BR/><BR/>-Dan S.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13030925.post-1140301027521865542006-02-18T16:17:00.000-06:002006-02-18T16:17:00.000-06:00Can't believe I forgot to include one of the most ...Can't believe I forgot to include one of the most obvious canards they like to bring up: The old Heaven and Hell routine. Kind of cheapens your good deeds if you're only after divine brownie points.<BR/><BR/>Doing good makes me feel good. Morality is very natural for me, and it doesn't involve some <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It%27s_a_Good_Life" REL="nofollow">guy with a thunderbolt</A> hovering over my shoulder.<BR/><BR/>When I make a decision while driving, the question "Is there a cop around?" never crosses my mind. I know the rules of the road were intended for efficiency and safety. I follow them because I don't want to be thought of as a jerk, and besides, personal experience suggests that speeding/aggressive driving only frustrates you. I can keep up with speeders because they don't seem to realize that speeding only gets you to the next "knot" of cars or red traffic light slightly faster. It's much like everything else in life.Bronze Doghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10938257296504189967noreply@blogger.com