Tuesday, December 08, 2009

Creationist Opener

I'm thinking about trying a line if someone asks me why I don't believe in Creationism: "I don't have enough faith in random chance."

The idea is born out of the response to endogenous retrovirus sequences as evidence for evolution. VenomFangX, former big time YouTube Creationist, essentially took that line, claiming that chimps and humans have the same ERVs because they both got the same virus. Of course, he didn't think about the chance occurrence that they'd all fall in the same locations on the genomes and all acquire fixation. But given that anyone who takes the issue seriously would know that sort of thing, it almost comes across as a Creationist invoking random chance as their explanation.

And that's not too far off, given what I've seen a lot of Creationists say. They often say God is too unpredictable (AKA random) for science to study (and yet predictable enough for it to be 'obvious' to a bunch of laymen). They're certainly fond of picking on any alleged sort of randomness, like asking how wonderful it is that our pothole so obviously appears designed to exactly fit our puddle. Of course, if the laws of physics were determined randomly, Occam's Razor still favors atheism: What are the chances that a God would form from nothing with the means and desire to form this exact universe? They're addressing a problem by answering it with the exact same problem. I know an old lady who swallowed a fly...

12 comments:

Buford said...

Perhaps she'll die.

DM said...

http://www.conspiracycafe.net/forum/index.php?/topic/25104-atheist-apocalypse/page__pid__117856__st__


Sing from the rooftops: "Atheism is dead!"

Bronze Dog said...

I let Dave Mabus through, because he's a cute spammer, and I'd rather not deal with rolling my eyes if he complained.

Of course, Dave, you're welcome to actually bother to talk meaningfully, rather than spam like a bot.

Akusai said...

Maybe one of these days he'll even learn HTML and post hyperlinks instead of text URLs.

Regarding the actual post, I think it might be more trouble than it's worth. It's not immediately intuitive why so much of creationism involves random chance, and using that response would necessitate a long explanation. I don't know about you, but I just don't have the patience to talk to creationists for that long.

Jacqueline said...

Akusai said:

"Maybe one of these days he'll even learn HTML and post hyperlinks instead of text URLs."

I wish someone would teach me.

JS:)

Jacqueline said...

BD said:

"Of course, Dave, you're welcome to actually bother to talk meaningfully, rather than spam like a bot."


Rational to the last our hero, Bronze, tried to communicate with the raveningly mad chaos squirrel!


JS;)

Yakaru said...

Yeh, arguing that all those genetic similarities across all species is not a sign of common descent is like arguing that American English and British English are two distinct languages, and the similarities are purely coincidental.

But creatioinsts would just say God did it like that cos it was easier that way, or something.

Looking at Kent Hovind's PhD paper, which PZ just posted a link to, is a good reminder just how far gone these maniacs are. Logic is not a weapon these people recognise. They're fighting Satan.

P.S. Jacqueline, Skeptico has a good page describing HTML - that's where I learned it!

Jacqueline said...

Yakaru posted:

"Jacqueline, Skeptico has a good page describing HTML - that's where I learned it!"

Cheers my dear!

Bronze Dog said...

Akusai: "Regarding the actual post, I think it might be more trouble than it's worth. It's not immediately intuitive why so much of creationism involves random chance, and using that response would necessitate a long explanation. I don't know about you, but I just don't have the patience to talk to creationists for that long."

Pretty much why it's an opener: They get a WTF? moment, and I explain it.

DM said...

First of all: Nostradamus demolishes "atheism"


____________________________________________________
wait, wait...


I forgot something...


you little shits even talk about me....


GOATS ON FIRE....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssFaIhJkLsk




LIBERATION!


Sing from the rooftops:

"Atheism is dead!"

http://www.conspiracycafe.net/forum/index.php?/topic/25104-atheist-apocalypse/page__pid__117856_

Bronze Dog said...

Right, because postdictions by creatively interpreting some guy's words after the fact is so utterly amazing.

*Yawn*

Jacqueline said...

That mad Markuze bloke spake:

"GOATS ON FIRE...."

Will that result in
PYGMIES + DWARFS?

"Atheism is dead!"

Which is why there are a gazillion atheist blogs on the net. Seems to me that your silly parochial deity is as dead as a dodo Dave, and not even Jebus can ressurect His mouldering corpse!

JS:)